Speak Out Loud NA

Sunday, January 22, 2006

Interesting Information

There is some very interesting information posted on the FREEDOM OF SPEECH blog today. Seems as if they've caught another one with their hand in the cookie jar.
If you haven't already read it, you may want to take a look.
For those who like to refer to us as "paranoid", and to those who believe we are just here to bad-mouth the City, let us take a moment of your time to explain a couple of things.
We are not operating this forum just because we have nothing else to do. We are not devoting many late nights and long hours of our time just because we want to 'slam' New Albany. We love New Albany. We live here, some work here, others are concerned about our plight here. But, the basic foundation of this blog is the concern we have for New Albany. The desire to see it succeed and thrive.
Yes, great things could happen to our little town. The possibilities are endless. Some have been preaching for years about living spaces in the upper floors of Downtown and "support/service" small businesses start-ups that would be generated by such. We all want the quality of life to improve through success by New Albany.
It - success - measured as an 'improved quality of life for the majority'- would be possible if the best interests of the majority of the population were being served by the "Community Power Structure" that controls it.
However, if we don't root out the infection of "specialized" politics (for lack of a better term) that keeps our community sickly and pale by comparison to cities around us, then we will continue to falter and always wind up trying to nurse small scatter-shot ventures into success. [For an interesting read, take a look at Larry Lyon's "The Community in Urban Society"]
"Any successful attempt to improve the local quality of life must be cognizant of the unequal distribution of community power. In fact, the first systematic study of community power began with an attempt to improve the local quality of life."
How many times have we attempted to talk about the "quality of life" issues on this blog? How many discussions have we had about that being the same end result we are ALL striving for? A better New Albany for everyone.
What some of us are trying to make happen, is an honest-to-God (to all our Atheist 'friends', excuse the objectional referance) better quality of life for EVERYONE in EVERY segment of the population. Wouldn't that be the most desired end result? "EVERYBODY does what is best for the MAJORITY of the inhabitants of the community" (Aristotle, Politics)... more or less -
We cannot continue to allow things to get "swept under the rug" (we were warned), and obvious favortism pervade our local government and adversly affect the quality of life issues for the majority of the community inhabitants.
We are trying to make New Albany a better community, only we want it better all the way through. However, what New Albany has, is a "Community Power Structure" that is elitist in nature, elitist being a select few with socio-economic priviledges. and; "Although these elite leaders held no political office,...they managed to effectively control the local government." (Lyon).
We have more to say on this subject, but we want to stop here and give folks time to think about this a little bit. Just give some thought to the idea that when community power leaders gain control of the local political processes, the predicted possibilities for long term successes for that community in terms of actual improvement in quality of life for the majority of the citizenry, are grim.
"City governments that include nonpartisan elections, a city manager, and at-large representation are more likely to have dimensions of elitism (Clark, 1971; Grimes et al. 1976). ...the reform movement that transformed many cities of the ...midwest...into more "businesslike" governments also insulated them from the demands of the public they represented. This lessening of the public accountability appears to have increased the possibility for elitist power structures."
(Lyon).
'nuf said for now.

92 Comments:

  • Laura: Could you give us a path or an
    address to find Freedon of Speech and
    be able to read the information that you mentioned in your article.

    Thank you, Laura, for your time and efforts to keep us aware of what is
    really going on in New Albany.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:45 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • Note posting- 1:49 PM January 22, 2006

    Anonymous said....

    Indiana State Board of Accounts Department needs to know if the City Audit matters are being kept secret by the City Administration. If the money was missing and had to be paid back to the City, why was this fact not made public?

    So-- it won't do any good for the City of New Albany to have a State Audit for 2004-2005 if the results are not going to be made public.

    Who can we talk to at the state level?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:54 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • Sorry folks, for forgetting to change the link.
    You can now click on the link at the bottom of the article.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 8:12 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • I don't know how something like this could have been kept secret for 2 years. It seems like everybody knows everybody else's business in this town.

    But the fact is we do need an audit, and we need one now.

    Freedom of Speech said something about this being the tip of the iceberg. That is a scary thought. How many other departments have thieves in their midst?

    I'm not saying this only goes on in City Hall, there are a lot of thieves in the private sector too, as everyone knows.

    But the point is, we need to root out the problems downtown.

    Someone asked what can we do at the State level. That is a good question. How do we get a hold of this Charlie Pride? Can he help us?

    If anybody over at Freedom of Speech is reading this, please let us know who to contact for more information.

    We need to "clean up New Albany" in more ways than one.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:26 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • This may be a big can of worms, but doesn't our Council get copies and exit interviews about the audits? Were Council provided with the 03 information, or was it kept from them? '04 isn't back yet, or so taxpayers are being told. This needs to be publically asked of each Council member, if they have these documents, or if certain info was withheld.
    My bet is certain Council members had this info withheld from them. It's not in my copy either, which I would have obtained (legally) from a Council member. We, the public can pay for the audits and be on the list when they come out, after the exit interviews with Council President.
    Charlie Pride's number is 317-232-2521. Or, you can talk with Scott Shireman locally at 941-6970. Scott is a nice fellow working for the State in an office besides the County Treasurer's office.
    If anyone calls, maybe we can get a feel for when 2004 audit will fall, what year is this?
    Thanks Freedom of Speech, and East Ender for this article. Now, let the chips fall where they may.
    Our opinions.

    By Anonymous IT'S JUST ZEROES, at 8:46 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • In the context of Lyon's quoted statements, what is your reaction to this:

    "A community power structure doesn't exist in a vacuum.
    It is subject to a wide array of outside forces (eg., state
    and federal laws, sources of money outside the community,
    etc.)"

    Just curious.

    BTW, when asked the same question, Steve Price responded, "live music never goes out of style."

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 8:54 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • This is for one of our other blogs in town, the NA Confidential.

    Why can't it be possible that different blogs have different reasons for existing? Why don't you link your blog to the Chamber of Commerce in order for people to see what a wonderful place NA is.

    We can keep the taxpayer activist work "secret" and on the down and dirty, and not expose anyone to what they may be walking into (tax and fee wise, much less sewer bills).

    Why do you feel taxpayer activists watching over the monies should not have a way to communicate, the same as you do with your buds?

    Regarding your comment about Councilman Price needing to take a walk, as far as we are concerned, he looks like he has walked and kept in shape, unlike somebody which made that statement.

    I appreciate your opinions, but don't necessarily agree with them -- but hey, that's what living in the USA is all about; as long as we can agree to disagree civilly?
    Maybe? Can't we all exist in harmony? No logic as to why we can't or couldn't unless we just don't fit into YOUR agenda or mind set.

    Can you tell me if DNA is still thinking about or trying to rent the apartments above those buildings out for the landlords? Our family wishes the City could help us with leasing our apartments out. Sure would save us some monies, too. What was the amount, $37,000.00 to hand out leaflets about these buildings which had the apartments above them for rent? Hell, for $37,000, I'd walk all of NA with those leaflets.

    We enjoy ALL the blogs, even if we don't post on them.

    Just our opinions of the situation.
    Thanks to all, because sometimes we are all in total agreement on some issues, yet don't see it.

    By Anonymous SOLNA BLOG PURPOSE, at 9:04 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • I have been told no council member has seen nor do they have this report. It was being held out for those to not see? Interesting uh.....Got a question? How come the Mayor has sat on this information for so long? And how come the person was not charged? In the reading of the article "FREEDOM OF SPEECH" must have more than one case? Isn't this white collar crime? Can someone explain this whole mess?
    Is this a cover-up? or what?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:42 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • This is an outrage to think Mayor Garner is covering this up.
    This person only resigned?
    How about jail time.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:53 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • WHO WILL DEFEND THE MAYOR NOW.
    HOW DO I CONTACT FREEDOM OF SPEECH AND THANK THEM FOR INFORMING US?
    THANK YOU LAURA

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:12 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • Certain people are looking at their copy of the 2003 audit, and do not see any of this information. Could this possibly be coming out from the Broadus lawsuit?
    Taxpayers have been told by previous Prosecutors and a State Police Officer that the State Board of Accounts HAD TO refer information of this kind of the Prosecutor for prosecution.

    If this happened in 2003, that would have been under Overton, and the City Attorney was Henderson. Could he have chosen not to have prosecuted? Is that something left to his discretion?

    Guess there is more to come. Matter of fact, I think I'd have to bank on it. Interesting, very interesting...and the beat goes on.
    Our opinions and questions.
    Thanks for the space, Laura.

    By Anonymous Wonder Why?, at 11:30 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • It does indeed, remain to be seen, where and when this information will take us.
    Interesting stuff. I think a new understanding of how things work within the Power Structures of our community will become a little clearer.
    --- outside influences are a given, but they must be mitigated as either positive or negative in terms of serving the ultimate purpose of what's in the best interest of the most people.
    Not what's in the best interest of an elite few.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 11:56 PM, January 22, 2006  

  • Anon 9:42pm

    No Council Member knew of this report? What else don't they know?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 6:33 AM, January 23, 2006  

  • 2003 audit of Floyd Co. Auditors office has interesting info in it too.

    People getting paid for days they didn't work. Somebody there had to pay money back too,

    Contact State Board of Accounts to get copies of all audits.

    By Anonymous lots of coverups, at 7:59 AM, January 23, 2006  

  • If a person can work in the City-County bldg and steal money, then have 2 yrs to pay it back....

    I want to know where to apply for a job!!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:57 AM, January 23, 2006  

  • Regarding the missing funds in the Building Commissoners Department.

    Why didn't the Mayor and Controller report this to the Council in August 2005? Why was this matter kept secret?

    Was Maury Goldberg on the Council in
    2003? Mr. Goldberg has a legal
    background in his work. Has Mr. Goldberg offered his opinion on this case in the Building Commissioners
    Department?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:17 AM, January 23, 2006  

  • Starting to hear rumblings there may have been an "Addendum" issued after the Audit was done, and this information may be included in that paperwork. The question still would be, was the Council President for 2003 provided this information after the "exit" interview they have with each Audit? We want to know why some Council members seem to know and some don't.

    We understand the monies have been repaid, but need to understand the process of what happened when, etc.

    Our opinions and questions, for anyone who cares. Thanks.

    By Anonymous WHAT'S THE DEAL?, at 12:44 PM, January 23, 2006  

  • Could this have been discussed in the Budget Hearings of 2004?
    Is that the one that Randy Smith was asking people to leave from?
    I seem to remember...

    By Anonymous just curious, at 2:43 PM, January 23, 2006  

  • Time to gather more details it seems. Didn't somebody say earlier; "...the devil's in the details"?
    Going to be interesting to get more familiar with this sequence of time.
    Let's begin at the beginning...

    By Blogger East Ender, at 2:56 PM, January 23, 2006  

  • Isn't it funny that the other blogsites are choosing to ignore the Freedom of Speech posting of stolen
    money from the Building Commissioners
    Department that was reported by the State Board of Accounts to Mayor Garner and the Controller in August
    2005?

    They are always so q

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:01 PM, January 23, 2006  

  • How did Randy Smith think that he had the authority to ask the public to leave the room? What public meeting was this? When?

    Is this a new position that the Mayor
    has established for Mr. Smith?

    Or--- did Council President GAhan establish this position for Mr.Smith?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:06 PM, January 23, 2006  

  • Is Maury Goldberg aware of this sisution? We want answers.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:14 PM, January 23, 2006  

  • I'm still trying to figure out why my front page is suddenly whacked out and all the links, including the Tribune link, have disappeared from their normal position in the right coloumn, and repositioned themselves all the way down and to the far right of a sliding screen.
    How cute.
    We will try to restore normalcy to our links section as soon as we figure out what got changed.
    Meanwhile, everyone grab a Tribune and see what's got Randy in such a tizzy.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 3:15 PM, January 23, 2006  

  • Laura

    The fact of the current Garnergate Cover-up. And when we figure out what he has to hide. May tell us what the hell is going on downtown?
    This has generated more talk, more anger, more disappointment in James Garner.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:41 PM, January 23, 2006  

  • anonymous: Click on Freedom Of Speech underlined. And then go to profile and you can email.

    What recourse do we have on this current info Laura?
    We have contacted the mayor's office and no one has returned my call? My husband says this is some more of Garners B/S.Were any laws broken on Garners part? We think so..

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:51 PM, January 23, 2006  

  • We are gathering information about the 2004 budget, reviewing what Council Members did or did not recieve, and will let you know when we have determined what has happened and who knows what.
    Meanwhile, we suggest you avail yourself of the information provided to contact State reps. in town, and in Indianapolis.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 6:34 PM, January 23, 2006  

  • The meeting we were asked to leave was the 2005 budget hearings. There were only 3 people in the room, one being the press. The meeting was scheduled for the public, but the Council wanted the State Rep at the time, to address them. Unfortunately for the Council and Randy, the legal ran contrary to what he thought. He then felt he had the right to ask the two members of the public AND THE PRESS to leave the room. The only thing he was short-sighted in was the fact Denny Stroud WOULD NOT, IN ANY MEANS, attend a meeting where the legal was posted wrong.

    We all need to call Charlie Pride and (yes, we will HAVE TO PAY, WHAT ELSE IS NEW) to get both the audit, and the addenduum.

    Let's all chip in together, what do you say?

    Take care, Any type of Activists, it's simply our family's opinions. We already know they aren't worth much...It's been proven. Thanks for the space.

    By Anonymous Any answer better than none, I guess..., at 1:19 AM, January 24, 2006  

  • P.S. It could have been the 2004 budget hearings, we have been to sooooooo mannnnyyyyy, it's hard to keep up. When did RANDY COME ON THE SCENE? That should answer that question. Take care NA, we all need to SPEAK OUT AS LOUD AS WE CAN... maybe someone will grease the squeaky wheels. Ya think?

    By Anonymous P.S. TO ANY ANSWER..., at 1:22 AM, January 24, 2006  

  • Concerning the 2005 budget hearing.

    If Randy Smith asked the other three people to leave, was he allowed to stay? If so, why?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:38 AM, January 24, 2006  

  • Oh yes, Randy was behaving as though "in charge" of the proceedings of the meeting.
    This is when he uttered the famous line; "What? I thought EVERYBODY knew who I was." when questioned as to his identity after asking people to leave the meeting.
    Remember?
    There's lot's of people that remember that one.
    Was that the beginning that Laura spoke of starting at?

    By Anonymous just curious, at 7:59 AM, January 24, 2006  

  • Freedom of Speech has posted additional information and questions.
    You can use the link on the original article to get there.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:03 AM, January 24, 2006  

  • I will be the first to admit that my writing and grammar skills are not first rate. On FOS this last posting is pathetic for a "college professor".

    "Was any laws broken in how this sisution was handled?" WERE any laws... SITUATION.

    "Why was no Council President there..." How may Council Presidents are there?

    My point is not bad grammar for the average person. A "college professor", in an academic setting, would surely write better than that. While this story may be true, I have trouble believing anything that Erik writes. For more, please see EE's posting "New posting on it's way". I am called an idiot by Erik(one voice) and I have asked the esteemed "professor" to enlighten me.

    By Blogger Iamhoosier, at 8:56 AM, January 24, 2006  

  • IAMHOOSIER, also notice in the desciption part of the "blog" and the talk about the Freedom of Speech and it being so important to the little people. Only one "freedom" or "right" mentioned there, but in just the next sentence it goes on and on about protecting these freedoms and these rights....

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:53 AM, January 24, 2006  

  • But the most important thing to remember is that "Erik" is a fictional character created by sad and small minds deperately in need of the legitimacy of a quasi-educational pedigree.

    In other words, it's a sham -- and anything written therein is cheapened by the sham, even if it's true.

    Why not just use your real name?

    You may commence squawking.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 10:44 AM, January 24, 2006  

  • TNA I think for once you are right.

    Even if the "findings" do have truth to them, most people can only take it with a grain of salt because everything else surrounding this information is false.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:29 AM, January 24, 2006  

  • DUH---THIS FREEDOM OF SPEECH GUY SHOULD GET HIS MONEY BACK HE FORKED OUT FOR HIS DEGREE----THERE ARE FOUR SCHOOL BOARD SEATS ALSO UP FOR ELECTION IN MAY--TWO DISTRICT SEATS AND TWO AT LARGE---AND THERE IS NO PRIMARY FOR THESE SEATS!! MUST HAVE SLIPPED HIS MIND.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:35 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • You know, I don't think it matters one bit how bad the grammer is, or what the spelling problems are.
    The ISSUE is what happened. You can't "cheapen" that just because this person, who obviously wishes to remain anonymous, has trouble with grammer.
    You can try to take the heat off the subject by pointing out the deficits in writing skills, but you can't make it go away.
    How elitist can you get?
    Nothing has any credibility if it doesn't come from a college professor, or someone who can write
    like one? Gimme a break.
    The issue is we have corruption in our midst, and it was kept secret. WHY?
    What else do we not know about, and what will the 2005 audit we're all waiting on have in it that will be kept a secret?
    This type of cover-up cannot be allowed to persist.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 1:04 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • i believe what they are trying to say is the same as people have been saying on this cry-sheet for a while now.

    Everyone is suspect in your eyes. You know how they say you attract more flies with honey then vinegar? Yeah, it's true. It may be total BS and unfair but it's true.

    This blog can also be likened to the boy who cried wolf. now s**T is hitting the fan but noone cares to believe you because of all the tragedies there have been in the past!

    Can you see where others are coming from.

    Not everything is an attack, and by you feeling like everyone is out to get you? Wow how selfish can you get?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:15 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • Spin it however you like. It still comes out the same.
    Going after the messenger does not change the message.
    It's simply a diversionary tactic.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 1:25 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • Oh, excuse me for forgetting to add some 'honey'.
    Have a nice day now, and thanks for showing us how we err in our ways. Goodness knows, it's never personal. Jus bizness.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 1:29 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • EastEnder,

    We are still waiting on the 04 audit -- they aren't even going to start on the '05 until around May.

    We are also still waiting on the "approved" budget by the State. The Audit from 04 could be having an impact on why the Budget has not been approved yet. Who knows (not us, said the taxpayers)!

    And, if the Budget has not been approved yet, how are they making all of these promotions within the fire and police departments, if they don't know the money situation? It's a tough question to ask publically (becos of the politics), but we sure would like an answer.

    The Council should get a Budget Variance Report every month. It's usually referred to as the "greenbar" report. This document will tell Council if any of the departments are under, over, or in other words exactly where they stand in each department. But, if the Budget hasn't been approved, not sure how accurate the Monthly Variance Budget Report will be.

    CRY ME A RIVER, BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE WANT TO SEE HOW THEIR HARD EARNED TAX DOLLARS ARE BEING SPENT.

    This is a right we ALL have.

    It was the '04 budget hearings public was asked to leave, along with the press. We would have to ask why anyone would want this City to operate in the dark, without anyone present at the budget hearing. We know Denny Stroud was suppose to speak that night, but the legal was posted stating it was a PUBLIC meeting, which in turn caused Mr. Stroud to not speak. He would have never violated the legal posting, anyway. Taxpayers miss him and his ethics.

    Ethics...wouldn't it be great if we adopted some?

    Thanks for the space, East Ender. Our opinions, comments and questions.

    By Anonymous We'd Like To Know, Too, at 1:39 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • East Ender,

    Come on. I believe my point was pretty clear. It is obvious that Erik is not a college professor. I don't care if Erik uses their real name or not--I differ from Roger on that. I do care when someone is blatantly misrepresenting themselves. I would think that as someone who professes to want the truth, you would be rather upset also. Is Erik so insecure in his/her knowledge and positions that he/she has to inflate his/her resume?

    Please read all of my post above. I admitted that my own grammar skills are deficient. I even said that the article may be true.

    I am not trying to divert anything. I have no reason to. Seems to me that you are attempting to divert attention away from an imposter.

    Elitist? Tell me where I have ever said that someone needed to be a college professor or write like one to be valid.

    I am still waiting for One Voice(Erik)to further my education.

    By Blogger Iamhoosier, at 2:46 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • Yup.
    They must be held accountable for our money and the money that comes in from "outside sources".
    Allotments, and entitlements and incentive program money is going where? We want to know.
    Is the addendum to the 2004 audit related to the building commissioner's office?
    Hasn't a law suit been filed on that?
    We should call our Council Reps. and see what kind of answers we'll get about those monthly variance reports.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 2:51 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • The fact is the info was kept from the public! No charges placed. No ARREST!
    How much other information is being kept from us? Stealing is stealing! I support Freedom of Speech for bring it to the public. What have you done lately for the taxpayers?

    Great blogs
    Laura

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:11 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • Iamhoosier does have a point about this person. I think you can remain anonymous, but why pretend to be someone that you are not. Facts are facts no matter how they are spelled or put, why not just be yourself and just put the facts out there without hiding behind the bs background. Just my opinion.

    By Anonymous feduptaxpayer, at 3:23 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • ....p.s. good info by the way fos.

    By Anonymous feduptaxpayer, at 3:27 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • you all are a bunch of town criers, wheres your proof,,you aint got it cuz you there is none.

    why dont you do something for this town like join the harvest homecoming committee or something. cause youre wasting your time with this witch hunt

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:30 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • anonymous

    The proof is there....baylorite explain the truth and the facts as you may. But go steal some $$$$ and see what Keith Henderson does to you!
    YOU CAN'T BLOG IN JAIL..

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:06 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • Amen Anonymous! nor can you drink Budlight.
    Been there done that. No jail time is C.R.A.P.
    real men of genius drink

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:40 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • Methinks Mr. Smith was trying to divert attention away from the 2004 Budget Hearing by bringing up the invisible Erik's spelling and grammar.

    Was he allowed to stay at the meeting after asking others to leave?

    Who gave him the right to ask other citizens to leave? One would assume this job would only be assinged to Chief Harl.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 6:44 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • I guess R&R still think It's ok to steal as long as you have the Mayors approval.
    So who is calling the kettle black now!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:00 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • We should clarify that the episode revealed on Freedom of Speech, from the 2004 audit, has nothing to do with the issues of former Building Commissioner inspector Broadus'(sp?) law suit.
    The incident took place in 2004 when Gary House was Building Commissioner.
    Although Mr. Broadus was working as an inspector at the time, our sources tell us this is not relevent to his situation.
    What IS relevent, is the fact that this was another mess swept under the rug (we've been warned) and left there for someone to stumble upon.
    What's the next mess under the rug going to be? Someone will stumble upon it eventually.
    Meanwhile, the Stormwater fees are now being assessed, and we still maintain that this fee is inequitable and unfair.
    The insert is interesting:
    "The Mayor and Council feel it is important to maintain New Albany's quaolity of life, which includes minimizing taxes and fees to our residents".
    Oh, really?
    What's that we're hearing about a sewer rate being "inevitable"?
    Where's THAT audit?

    By Blogger East Ender, at 8:01 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • Laura, you miss the point so often that it's comical.

    "Nothing has any credibility if it doesn't come from a college professor, or someone who can write
    like one? Gimme a break."

    That's the polar opposite of my point, which is why does someone go beyond anonymity (iself inexcusable) to PRETENDING to be something he or she is NOT, going so far as to cloak the deception with an invented name, degree and job?

    That's past sad. It's psycho.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 9:27 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • EastEnder, Me thinks the episode happened in 2003 under Overton and came out this past year under Garner.

    To Anon: Yes, Randy was allowed to stay at the meeting, as the other three stayed. Also feel Chief Harl knew nothing about it. Council had not yet entered the room. The CJ was not impressed with his behavior. We know the two citizens asked to leave suddenly got crazy glue on their butts, and would not have left after that outburst, unless they were HAULED out.

    We don't understand why he did what he did; nor do we know who gave him the authority. He was asked that question by one of the citizens "who are you working for", but alas he did not respond. When the CJ asked him who he was, that's when he said "I assumed everyone knew who I was".

    We just love going to meetings in this town. Can you imagine how Huckleberry feels? I can't. And other people wonder why we wonder WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON! You make your bed, you get to sleep in it. Some citizens do demand accountability from their elected officials, but it will take an exacting toll on your spirit, sometimes your feelings, etc. It's like they try to wear you down so you will JUST GIVE IT UP. One of the most favorite ploys we have enjoyed is the one where they act like you are SOOOO STUPID. Sometimes we have played stupid, just to find out what we want to know. Ain't giving up no ghost here.

    New days are dawning in NA for accountability in politics -- shame everyone's not on that bandwagon.

    We feel that some of the newer people may be wisening up about the dilapidated buildings and they may be getting frustrated trying to do what we have tried to do for the past 15 years, clean up NA. We heard it stated last night the Building Commissioner was working on a plan to do that "thang". The laws are already on the books; there is simply this selective enforcement isue we keep talking about. It is truly BS if he said they didn't know who the property owners were. Will someone please tell them how they find who owns the property in NA. I think it's two floors down from them. They may walk right past there when they come into work. BS and more BS.

    Thanks to whomever asked. Take care, and hang on...Forum is coming out soon. Jeff does GOOD WORKS, too!

    Did you like the Grandmother's letter to the Editor about Baylor's letter? The $10.00 words and did you scratch that itch -- now, that was funny. All we say to someone who asks me to prove there is a God, we tell them to prove to us there isn't one.

    Now, as the New Albanian said earlier, and I'm talking to you New Albanian, you may start your "squawking" anytime.

    We, the citizens...

    By Anonymous Staying Anonymous, No Matter What!, at 10:07 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • So, Yvonne, why not post under your own name?

    And while you're at it, send a calendar to Jeff R. It's 2006, and time to go on line with his selective interpretations.

    How's the Main Street gay bashing going?

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 11:00 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • New Albanian, I just wouldn't believe everything I hear. If you really believe what you printed, I feel sorry for you because you have been misled for what HAS TO BE PURPOSEFUL, MALICIOUS, AND FALSE info in order to make you look foolish. Hang in there. It'll happen to the best of us, sometimes! Take care.
    Why does Yvonne get ALL THE CREDIT, gee Louise.

    By Anonymous KEEP ON GUESSING, IT SURE IS FUN, HUH?, at 11:17 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • With people writing things like you do, New Albanian, who would want you to know their name? WHY IS THAT SO IMPORTANT TO YOU?

    Yvonne is a private citizen and accusing her of gay bashing is slander and libel. If that was truly going on, don't you think whoever you are referring to would sue her? Maybe she can sue you. Give us a break.

    You are barking up the wrong tree with this one. Sorry to disappoint you. At least the whole town can read this one. We do think you may have overstepped on this one. As someone who knows her, we are willing to bet on this one.

    Send Jeff your own daggone calendar. You are selective enough, without accusing anyone else. See ya in the funny papers, I guess...that's where we last saw ya, huh?

    By Anonymous DON'T YOU WISH IT WERE TRUE, SO YOU COULD BE RIGHT ONCE?, at 11:24 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • Isn't this pitiful? Playing Canasta with friends, and start getting phone calls, and voila, once again, there I am in black and white.

    There is no gay bashing going on on Main Street, Roger. Who ever said that must have been trying to cover up ALL OF THEIR BUILDING CODE VIOLATIONS FROM THE STATE OF INDIANA AND THE BZA VIOLATIONS.

    Guess I'll be happy to take the heat, seeing I live next door to the property in question. We have a file two inches thick. Might want to check your facts with the City Attorney, or the Mayor.

    Other than that, I would say it's none of your business, but as has been noted on here before, you seem hell bent on making it your business.

    Seeing I don't have a problem putting my name out there, ponder on this one for a minute - BITE ME!

    And whoever is feeding you the bologna, just tell 'em that bird don't fly anymore. Talk about hysteria, you got any more for me? May I finish my card game now without getting anymore phone calls? Gee, thanks. And THAT WOULD BE MY OPINION.

    And to people responding to him, don't bother. Let him hurl his lies and inuendos. Anyone who knows me knows I've been called a lot worse, and you can take that to the bank.

    Yep, I guess I will be seeing you in the funny papers, too.

    Now, here is my name for you. Like seeing it? Good for you.

    By Anonymous Yvonne Kersey, at 11:44 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • Give him a break, Yvonne. He's trying to figure out which one of the three people are talking about the budget hearings. He must know you were one of them and is trying to figure out who's talking about what, still.

    He will start counting soon, to 100, to show you his intellect and logic and rationale (mindset).

    He must not want to waste his $10.00 words on you. Maybe he feels you might understand them. I'd take that as a compliment.

    By Anonymous AnonAnonAnonAnonAnonAnonAnonAnonAnonAnon, at 11:54 PM, January 24, 2006  

  • You know Roger, you kinda stumbled upon something in there where we actually think alike.
    Although you were busy bashing the next guy in line -- Freedom of Speech, and I was thinking of the public perception of New Albany's government:
    "It's a sham...and anything [done or said] therin is cheapened by the sham... even if it's true."
    More or less, I think you've captured the basic idea of a good way to look at things, and determine their value.
    Either for blogs, or for believers, and even for governments.
    If they've been shown to be a sham, then everything else becomes suspect too.
    Yeah, I can even agree that there's really no need to create false personas just to stay anonymous if one likes, or to keep things "private" if another likes. Only, it kinda makes one suspect as to the overall operation, ...uh, intelligence of a [government] don't it?
    Then again, maybe we shouldn't make assumptions. You know what they say about the "assume" logic. It usually doesn't work.
    Now Karma, that sh*t works!

    By Blogger East Ender, at 1:53 AM, January 25, 2006  

  • new albanian

    Why don't you post under "Roger Baylor" instead of all the aka: anoynmous post as well.
    Sounds like to us you again have a different type of standard. You and R&R need a better source than what you have located on Main Street. Do you need more seed?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:59 AM, January 25, 2006  

  • Thank you, Yvonne. At last someone here answered one of my questions.

    Is there a Prof. Erik in the house?

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 8:03 AM, January 25, 2006  

  • Yvonne's been my neighbor for about 8 years. If someone is spreading a rumor that she is a gay basher, I will go on record as saying that that rumor is false.

    By Blogger New Alb Annie, at 8:39 AM, January 25, 2006  

  • Anon 6:44,
    You wrote

    "Methinks Mr. Smith was trying to divert attention away from the 2004 Budget Hearing by bringing up the invisible Erik's spelling and grammar."

    Where was Mr. Smith doing this diverting of attention? I don't recall seeing any posts about Erik from Mr. Smith lately.

    By Blogger Iamhoosier, at 8:55 AM, January 25, 2006  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 11:08 AM, January 25, 2006  

  • New Alb Annie, of course my question to Yvonne was offered in the most broad of senses, without any implied specific intent.

    Obviously, it's impossible to control what is read into such queries, but in any event, I appreciate that both you and her have answered the question.

    I'll not mention it again -- unless, of course, I do so anonymously. Which, of course, I never do.

    By the way, for the sake of the witch hunt, I'll guess that the three people in the council room were Randy Smith, Anna Schmidt and Yvonne Kersey.

    Do I win first prize (one night of free drinks at the Luddite Bar & Grill) or second prize (two nights)?

    Geez, I could really use a Progressive Beer just now.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 11:09 AM, January 25, 2006  

  • If Smith did attend the meeting in question, then, what authority and
    what position did he have to ask whomever was in that room to leave the
    room?

    Strange things are going on in that City Council Room. We will have to take the time and attend a meeting some time.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:50 AM, January 25, 2006  

  • RESPONSE TO 11:50 AM ANONYMOUS---

    YES, YOU SHOULD ATTEND THE COUNCIL MEETINGS AND SEE FOR YOURSELF WHAT IS GOING ON THERE.

    THERE SEEMS TO BE A LOT OF TACTICS BEING USED TO SCARE PEOPLE AWAY FROM THESE PUBLIC MEETINGS.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:55 AM, January 25, 2006  

  • Pretty simple, really. During the council work session in question (not budget hearings as reported), Denny Stroud refused to address the council regarding possible city budget outcomes (i.e, was the state going to hit NA with another cut)with the public present since the state hadn't rendered any decisions yet. Smith asked Stroud, who wouldn't even go into the room and was ready to leave, if he would speak to the council if the public left. The answer was yes.

    Smith then volunteered to leave and asked others present if they would be willing to do the same so that the session could continue as planned and the council could try to get the information they wanted. Kersey and Schmidt refused to leave and, whether purposely or not, kept the council from having the conversation they felt they needed to have with Stroud.

    If there's a beef here, it's with Stroud as he was the one who objected to the presence of the public, not Smith, who himself was a member of that public.

    The desperate grasping at straws to fill in conspiratorial blanks is amusing in a sopa opera-ish sort of way but ultimately a sad reflection of politics as usual from those who ridiculously claim their mission to be the rooting out of such corruption. It's only led to more lies, continued misinformation, and an even greater erosion of credibility. The fact that the information leading to this rush to prove conspiracy (none of which actually mentions stealing, cover ups, or abuse of power by the way) was published by a fictitious character makes it even funnier/sadder.

    I've often thought it would be fun to simply start making up facts and plot twists as some do around here, purely for entertainment value. The level of gullibility and willing suspension of disbelief displayed by SOLNA devotees is a storyteller's dream. Fortunately (or unfortunately for entertainment purposes), I have more self-respect than that.

    BTW, should I get the sunroof or the satellite radio or both?

    By Blogger bluegill, at 12:49 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • I believe the point in bringing up the encounter was in trying to figure how Randy Smith, a simple member of the public, has been up in the middle of meetings, taking control over the situation, as if he were a member of the administration.
    Why is Randy Smith addressing Denny Stroud and attempting to make anything happen?
    What part does Randy play in the administrations tactics of 'handling' the public, and even the handling of meetings?
    Why is Randy getting information the Council Members are not getting? How did Randy post the changes in Committees before the Council session was held, if he were only 'a memeber of the public'?
    Spin us another one Randy, this smells like the sewer mess.
    How and why are you the Mayor's new advisor, and what is happening with T. Toran?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:54 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • Open your eyes.

    The council members are playing political games by purposely not asking to see information that they good and well know is available as public information to anyone who wants it or by denying they have seen information that they do have.

    Either it suits their purposes for their petty little political games or they are just too lazy to do the background work for jobs they were elected for which means a lot more than just showing up for meetings. It's a lot easier to act like they couldn't get the info than it is to actually read it and do the research needed to understand it.

    This blog would more appropriately be named Lie Out Loud. And the biggest lies might just be coming out of the mouths of some of your trusted council members (or their spouses).

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:44 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • By the way, the agenda for the city council meeting is available to anyone who wants it prior to the meeting. If the council members don't even bother to get a copy and look at it before the meeting so that they can be prepared who's fault is that.

    Maybe that is one of the reasons that they come to meetings so ill-prepared to vote and have to abstain on so many things that they don't know anything about.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:49 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • some people need to keep selling seed and stop trying to feed info

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:28 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • Laura

    Looks like we pulled all the progressive over on our turf! Don't none of them have anything to blog about...Yvonne you don't need your main street neighbors to defend you. We all know what a great person you are!The real Speakout loud group knows exactly what you stand for! Were just waiting for that train wreck! Here's one "Bud for you Von."! If they only knew what we know uh!
    Was that the neighbor you have told all of us about?
    Hope Old Mrs. Smith hasn't froze to death? Anyone heard from her? What's wrong no attacks on Steve Price? How many ways can you spin his answers roger? You have met you match and you know it!

    Great article
    and great bloggin

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:40 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • Tiny Tim the Thong Wearer.
    here you go again.
    What is it with you and women?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:46 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • how real are you "bluegill" why not print your name?
    Can we please see "your Id" before you attack another person?

    Looks like you progressives have finally met your match!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:50 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • so funny

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:51 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • I think One Voice(Erik)froze. I'm still waiting.

    Your friend,
    Idiot

    By Blogger Iamhoosier, at 4:00 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • My name is Jeff Gillenwater. My indentity has never been hidden. If you click on my user name, you'll be magically transported to my profile where, like it has since day one, it clearly says Jeff Gillenwater.

    Another case of ignorance leading to accusations that have no basis in fact. Thanks for the evidence.

    By Blogger bluegill, at 4:21 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • I don't have to be a progressive to be disgusted with city council members who lie straight to my face and expect me to fall for their sugar-coated b.s.

    If not being stupid means I'm a progressive then I guess I'm a progressive.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:30 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • bluegill

    Can you scan your ID? Anyone can fix bluegill on any blog. Since roger is supposely an expert on url and hacking and etc. How do we know this is really you?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:16 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • Why don't we take a look back and see just which Council Members have been less than diligent with what they've said and what they've done.
    How 'bout that?
    What were those campaign promises I heard from CM Messer recently?
    I think we can find those again.
    How about CM Gahan and the promises he made to the voting public he promised to serve?
    How about Mrs. Crump and her constituency?
    How is that one working out?

    By Blogger East Ender, at 5:30 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • So someone got caught stealing money. And the article has cashier numbers and all. And this other crazy bunch says it never happen? Right?

    Well why don't someone contact the Mayor?

    Let's see who is telling the truth. Looks like Freedom Of Speech scooped you all on that news breaking audit report.

    So let's ask Mr. Baylor to contact the Mayor and find out if it happen are Not? Are you game Mr. Baylor? You are so quick to say it never happen!

    Your supposely the local guru on defending the Mayor?

    Why not solve this big mystery!

    Well roger do you not got the guts to follow thru and prove your right?

    Put up or shut up once and for all!

    Did it happen? Yes or no?

    gotcha Roger!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:31 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • Is reading comprehension really important to a lynch mob?

    Let's find out.

    "So let's ask Mr. Baylor to contact the Mayor and find out if it happen are Not? Are you game Mr. Baylor? You are so quick to say it never happen!"

    To my knowledge, I've not made a statement about it one way or another.

    "Your supposely the local guru on defending the Mayor?"

    Are you asking a question? If so, I don't believe the word "guru" applies to any of us.

    "Well roger do you not got the guts to follow thru and prove your right?"

    Sure, but to prove something I said was right, first I have to actually say it.

    "gotcha Roger!"

    Indeed. I'm on Candid Trogga. I guess I'll pack up the brewery and head to beautiful Birdseye, CM Coffey's urban dream.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 8:09 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • Your welcome Roger, and thanks New Alb Ann & others. Me and mine appreciate your comments.

    By Anonymous Yvonne Kersey, at 10:32 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • I have to say, I don't recall Roger making those statements either.
    He throws around a lot of bull, but we can't find anything to match these challenges.
    So, whoever is looking for accountability, I think you're asking the wrong guy. Honestly.
    We actually don't recall anyone saying it never happened.
    The long-winded, all knowing tales of late, espoused by Mr. Baylor, have been interrupted only long enough to blundle out a useless explination of "...only in the most broad of senses, without any specific implied intent." huh?
    The question was:
    "How's the Main St. gay bashing going?"
    How can that possibly be "...without any specific implied intent"?
    What kind of intent IS implied Roger?
    You'll cross any line in attempts to create your own scenario won't you?
    Best be careful.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 10:48 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • To the contrary, EE, I asked Yvonne a broad, general question precisely because I know she pays so close attention to the numbers and the details. Just the same as the questions that SOLNA readers always want to know, right?

    Touchy, aren't we?

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 11:10 PM, January 25, 2006  

  • Must've really touched a nerve or stepped on toes with that one, New Albanian.

    They're just trying to create a diversion and distract us from the issues by going after the messenger. Take the high road. You've got 'em on the run now.

    Just our family's rack and 'pinion. Until that shopping trip.

    By Blogger bluegill, at 12:00 AM, January 26, 2006  

  • To Anyone Who Cares:

    Yes, I was at that meeting. There were 3 members of the public, along with the CJ, right Randy?

    The point is there was a "legal" properly posted, which was advertised, and we paid good money for, stating it was a PUBLIC meeting. Do you think I don't know Council really needed to meet with Denny Stroud? Ha.

    Denny would not violate that legal, and you were wrong to ask us to, just so Council could have a workshop on how to do the budget. It is not our (taxpayers) fault the legal was stated for the "PUBLIC", which is ME and YOU. We didn't write the laws, we only try to follow them.

    Your argument stands without merits, in my books; and would appreciate you and yours attempts to keep on deflecting from the issue of WHY and WHO and WHAT purpose do you serve for the illustrious Mayor?

    Next?

    Think we may have hit that nerve, Bluegill -- not him. Answer the questions, and hold on to your seats for the next "conspiracy" theory. We know how much you enjoy same.

    My opinion.

    By Anonymous Yvonne Kersey, at 2:56 AM, January 26, 2006  

  • so funny.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 6:51 AM, January 26, 2006  

  • E ENDER---NOW THAT YOU'VE MADE THE CHALLENGES---PLEASE LIST THE PROMISES THEY MADE SO WE CAN CHECK THEM OUT.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:56 AM, January 26, 2006  

  • In the spirit of fairness, I must say that the past 2 postings on FOS have offered accurate and concise definitions of terms used in calculating our tax rates. Very nice.

    By Blogger Iamhoosier, at 11:51 AM, January 26, 2006  

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